Notice: Function _load_textdomain_just_in_time was called incorrectly. Translation loading for the twentysixteen domain was triggered too early. This is usually an indicator for some code in the plugin or theme running too early. Translations should be loaded at the init action or later. Please see Debugging in WordPress for more information. (This message was added in version 6.7.0.) in /home/dubdobde/public_html/wp-includes/functions.php on line 6131

Warning: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /home/dubdobde/public_html/wp-includes/functions.php:6131) in /home/dubdobde/public_html/wp-includes/feed-rss2-comments.php on line 8
Comments on: like tears in the rain (except they’re kept in a container in your freezer) https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/ oh no!! fite!! oh no!! Thu, 15 Nov 2012 12:13:00 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.9.4 By: sukrat OTI https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-340 Thu, 15 Nov 2012 12:13:00 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-340 In reply to Flapjack Charlie.

Yes, FC, this is exactly what I’m getting at — the establishment of a socially robust way-station between the “subjective” (intensely personal, not necessarily well communicated) mode of importance and the so-called “objective” mode (meaning in actuality importance as determined by the judgments of institutions, the relevant authorities, the market, and so on). As I’m imagining it, those aware of (or indeed fond of) the amasser of the material (like you, I find the word collection a bit unhelpful or misleading) would be those proposing that it perhaps had a wider importance — and would (if my suggestion finds a practicable form) then have a means to take this proposal to the next step. So what I’m looking at is a means by which “quite significant to a smallish number of people” could become “of unexpected interest to many more people” — or at least, by ensuring that the material doesn’t just instantly vanish into a skip lamented but unrecorded, that this possibility remains, for a while. The structure I’m looking at — at this extremely tentative and hypothetical stage! — would very much entail discussion and exploration, evaluation in the natural sense of people with an interest in such matters collectively and publicly* assessing whatever the material is. And — perhaps with Martin still in mind** — I’m thinking too how friends and colleagues sometimes have a more confident sense of the potential value of the material, and the mind that gathered it, than the mind is prepared to believe of itself. The material’s exact meaning — what you’re calling the “subjective” sense of its importance — is bound to morph somewhat during any such process: but this is in the nature of all communication at all times.

*In the sense of no qualification barriers to entry into a discussion, aside perhaps from a subscription fee (to cover admin and such)
**But also for example Max Brod and Kafka!

]]>
By: Flapjack Charlie https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-339 Thu, 15 Nov 2012 11:14:46 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-339 I don’t have a “collection” because I don’t “collect” records (or books, or…) like lifeless display butterflies. I amass things and try to find or make connections between them, and there’s a difference. Or rather, things accumulate rather than being formally assembled (unless, like TPL, I have to find some way of keeping all THAT stuff together). So I suspect that the only way these things have any objective worth would be through the connections that the owner makes with them, as described above. That in itself presupposes that the owner him/herself is sufficiently well known and/or important – such a subjective word, that – for an institution to be interested in keeping their things together in one connected place. I would ideally want all my “things” to stay together after I’ve gone, and I’ve made legal provision for that, but would anybody want to look at them without me being there to make my sense out of them? I wouldn’t be so arrogant as to think they would.

]]>
By: stet https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-331 Tue, 13 Nov 2012 23:03:22 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-331 Fantastic idea in this. Some interesting angles to it, too.

First, like Tim says, it feels like there may be a percentage of the collection that is fundamentally a holding pen awaiting digitisation, both for the VHS TV tapes where you want to get them out of their deteriorating formats asap and for the more permanent items such as comics where having them digitised would be great, but you also want to keep the original artefacts indefinitely.

Similar processes for this situation are actually already in place with current video archives, who extensively catalogue their contents but then only digitise them upon request. I can see that working well with this project: store, catalogue and (crucially) make the catalogue as well-known as possible. Then curious parties/the Jason Scotts/archive.orgs of the world can digitise/sponsor digitisation and make the results available, linked from the main catalogue.

The second interesting angle is that of it being essentially a “provisional, temporary” space. If entries in the catalogue had explicit “expiry dates” (beyond which there is no certain guarantee of their storage), that would:
a) help get the things people really wanted into safer, more permanent storage;
b) keep the things of mild interest in circulation — rather than potentially mouldering forgotten in a shed, they move on to their next willing home when their time is up; and
c) encourage participation — people would, I think, be much more likely to lend spare space to archive storage for a fixed period than they would be to commit to keeping things for The Rest Of Time.

Yes, this means that some things might expire and with nobody interested at all they could possibly be lost for good. Some of archiving is knowing what to throw away, an interest-driven selection process seems as good as any other model for that. Consider: if the BBC had said at the time “we’re thinking about dumping these ToTP and Dr Who tapes, anybody want to look after them?” I’m certain somebody would have stepped up.

Anyway, too long. I meant only to post to say I think it’s a fine idea, and would love to be involved.

]]>
By: Tallita Dyllen https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-330 Tue, 13 Nov 2012 19:12:23 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-330 The exquisite everyday comes to mind XO

]]>
By: sukrat OTI https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-329 Tue, 13 Nov 2012 17:23:56 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-329 Hi Archel! Yes, I think the long-term issues are large — but of course I fear they’re fairly large for established and even purpose-built institutions also. To blue-sky an argument in favour of amateur preservation&control protocols, I suppose I’d say something like — this would provide a provisional, temporary space from which (if interest emerged in the form of concrete research work) some material would graduate to more well appointed spaces. While stuff which resolutely proved unmoving to all would at least be looked after better in someone’s house than in landfill. (Not to say that some of it won’t belong in landfill… )

I may take you up on advice at some point — thanks! xM

]]>
By: Archel https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-328 Tue, 13 Nov 2012 17:03:07 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-328 As a cataloguer by trade I’m definitely interested in projects that describe physical collections and make the information about them discoverable to the interested researcher/collector/thinker/browser of the internet regardless of the physical location of the archive contents. A ‘distributed archive’ could be problematic for the long term because there aren’t really any institutional guarantees of preservation, or environmental controls etc, but the collaborative and interactive ‘mapping’ side sounds great. Happy to contribute some cataloguing advice/time, although archives aren’t really my area of expertise… I do think there are Kickstarter precedents for this kind of thing (eg http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/textfiles/the-information-cube-20 which funded physical curation/storage aspects).

]]>
By: sukrat OTI https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-327 Tue, 13 Nov 2012 16:56:12 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-327 Quite unexpectedly — NOTHING IS ACCIDENTAL PUNY MORTAL– this slightly ties in with the current Rihanna vs Seapunk argument on Tumblr, at least as seen thru Tom’s len here

]]>
By: sukrat OTI https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-326 Tue, 13 Nov 2012 16:43:07 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-326 In reply to sukrat OTI.

the tacit wisdom of amateur connoisseurship <-- digging this out would be a buried but important part of the "why" of it

]]>
By: sukrat OTI https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-325 Tue, 13 Nov 2012 16:39:25 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-325 In reply to Tim.

At a rough first estimate, I’d say such lists are the minimum requirement, and what I’m looking for entails more than just lists — which would emerge to some extent out of the social context created by the machinery put in place. Which means that how we fashion this machinery must be linked to the nature of the “more than” I’m feeling around for. It’s not a guarantee of quality — or even of interest — but it is a guarantee of the potential for connection (as in “only connect”, I guess). The collection was built round the connections the collector made — though these may be very fugitive indeed, far from well or clearly and truthfully stated. But its curation is built round the way the collector connected with his friends, colleagues, admirers, and such — and these modes of connection may well be in some tension!

(ie SOME of the people I’m imagining have such collections being isolates or eccentrics — people of rich sensibility but bad at communicating it, or wary of doing so… And others will be cheerfully meticulous — but interesting — hoarders whose gathering plan is apparently quite straightforward, but whose self-taught antennae suggest new ways to see things, or link them up, or explain or explore them… )

]]>
By: Tim https://dubdobdee.co.uk/2012/11/13/like-tears-in-the-rain-except-theyre-kept-in-a-container-in-your-freezer/#comment-324 Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:59:15 +0000 http://dubdobdee.co.uk/?p=432#comment-324 I often muse that there is no longer any point in keeping CDs in my collection which are (and now forever will be ) easily available in the broad world of spotify / file sharing / whatever comes next.

To achieve the kind of distributed archive you’re talking about, would you simply need a list of things, and where those things can be got? Then individuals could be the curators of any of those things which are not readily available in the downloady domain, and labelled as such, then as those things became downloadily available, the list could be amended but the collection would remain?

]]>